Según comunicado oficial publicado en la página web de Nintendo, la compañía presentó una demanda ayer por infracción de patentes en el Tribunal de Distrito de Tokio contra Pocketpair, creadores de Palworld.
La demanda solicita una medida cautelar contra la infracción y una indemnización por daños y perjuicios alegando que Palworld, infringe múltiples derechos de patente:
Quizá os preguntaréis por qué Nintendo ha denunciado ahora si durante meses las comparaciones has sido constantes...pues bien, hay quien dice que se han querido adelantar al lanzamiento de Palworld en PS5.
¿Vosotr@s qué pensáis? 🤔
EDICIÓN de última hora:
Pocketpair responde a la denuncia en X Bésicamente nos dicen que Nintendo aún no les ha dado detalles de qué patentes se les acusa haber copiado.
Continua el drama legal... : O
Otra teoría de por qué Nintendo ha puesto la noticia ahora: Hace poco que Palworld salió de acceso anticipado (?)
Última edición por CandelaSynth; 19/09/2024 a las 15:48
Opino exactamente lo mismo, la "inspiración" artística era más que evidente. Habrá que ir al detalle para ver exactamente lo que pelea Nintendo, quizás ni siquiera se base en los diseños de los Pals
Si, en el comunicado dice "patentes", me imagino que serán bichos concretos en lugar del concepto en sí (que ya se ha hecho mucho en el pasado pero que no infringía copyright per se).
No sé si te ha dado por mirar el comunicado de Pocketpair, pero si se demuestra que usaron los diseños base de Pokémon (como mucha gente sugería en internet), me parecería gran cinismo que Pocketpair diga que son sólo un estudio indie compitiendo con megacorporaciones...en fin 😅
Pues es verdad que han tardado, peeeeero, creo que se han tomado su tiempo para tener evidencias reales de que los diseños eran copiados (si es que es esa la denuncia). También está el tema de que le han quitado ya el "acceso anticipado" y su salto a PS5 : O
No he entrado a ver el detalle, la verdad, pero por mucho estudio independiente vs mega corporación que sea... hay cosas que son más que evidentes. Que Nintendo ataque a un fan-art o fan-mod me parece discutible, pero Poketpair se ha estado llenando bastante los bolsillos "basandose" en los Pokemons, perfectamente podía haber utilizado diseños completamente originales, usar cápsulas de captura en forma de botellas (por ejemplo) en lugar de pokeballs, etc.
Vamos, en mi opinión, buscaban ese parecido razonable y puede ser que les acabe saliendo rana
Pues eso...han "jurado" luchar contra Nintendo "por los fans y por los estudios independientes"...qué morro 😑
Hablando de estudios independientes, por fin jugué a Pluky Squire y está chulísimoooooo. Ejemplo perfecto de combinar cosas clásicas de una forma original.
PD, como es normal, todo el mundo está especulando ahora mismo en qué se basa en concreto la demanda, y precisamente hay gente que dice que puede que hayan sido las bolas (ains...te tenían que haber escuchado y hacer botellas en lugar de esferas! Además para el mercado español hubiera calado bien, sobre todo si se asocian con Estrella Galicia XD XD XD)
No han dicho que patentes son, pero dudo que sean simplemente aspectos porque eso provocaría que hicieran rediseños básicos y ya.
Luego esta el tema de pokeball... que ya habia juegos antes que capturabas enemigos con bolas, graficos, que ya antes habia juegos con graficos de estilo... vease tipo anime XD. Luchas entre bichos igual. Lo unico que he visto algun resquicio tal vez sea no se... gimnasios y pokeball crafteables?, no creo, de siempre ha habido elementos crafteables sobre todo cuando es un juego de construccion y supervivencia XD, e igual con jefes en sus bases.
Y tema de daños y tal... sinceramente creéis que algún fan de Pokemon ha comprado Palworld en vez de un juego de Pokemon?, inviable, si eso lo ha comprado como una alternativa con una temática parecida... con armas, supervivencia, esclavismo, movimiento libre tridimensional, construcción de cadenas de manufacturación, temas de comida, frio en noches y otras tantas cosas que no tienen nada que ver con Pokemon y hay juegos de hace mucho con ello ^^.
Es mas, yo creo que ha vendido mas por tener estetica tipico anime, armas y pasar del tema de ser inclusivo o respetuoso metiendo con humor el esclavismo y tal XD. Al menos a mi me llamo mas por el tema de supervivencia y poder llevar bichos con armas como en muchos juegos de Digimon.
Es mas, ojala se animaran a sacar un juego de Digimon mezclado con supervivencia. Cambian lanzar bolas con usar chips de escaneo y listo ^^. Ahi estaria yo de los primeros =D.
Sinceramente, no quiero que gane Nintendo si es tema de "fuerte inspiración", pero que si es por eso, cambien los modelos y los diferencien mas me parece estupendo.
Actualmente Nintendo esta lastrando bastante al no permitir crear obras derivadas ni inspiradas en ellos, ir contra fan-made y otros. Demasiado agresiva y poco permisiva cuando ni ellos ponen a disposición de otros formas de poder disfrutar de antiguos productos que ellos ya no permiten jugar de ninguna manera.
Si fuera por mi, si un juego no se esta comercializando pasado 5 años, debería permitirse licencias a un precio mínimo estipulado o incluso porcentual como obligando a darles el 30% de los beneficios al autor original. Y por comercializar me refiero a que un juego pueda comprarse, su consola y servicio online claramente. Y si no quiere que eso pase... pues sigues comercializándolo o adaptándolo con unos mínimos de calidad a los medios actuales... porque Nintendo no lo hace hasta el punto de COPIAR y no respetar las licencias de software libre de diversos emuladores.
Ahora en serio, Palworld ni lo habría probado si no estuviera en Gamepass, y ni le eche cuenta, me lo comentaron un día antes y por eso lo instale y me enganche XD. Para mi antes de probarlo era un juego meme genérico mas pero me sorprendió gratamente en su buena interfaz y sistema de construcción simple y efectivo adaptado para mando.
P.D.: No me gustan para nada los diseños de los Pokemons ni Palworld, los peluches estos que hacen y tal tenían excusas de simplicidad en su tiempo por los gráficos que con Digimon por ejemplo era muy difícil de representar cuando mas evolucionaban y se hacían mas complejos, pero desde luego mucho mas atractivos.
El conocimiento es poder, úsalo bien, pues su mal uso conlleva a la destrucción.
📹Grabando videos de juegos 4K de vez en cuando (seguramente el canal de videojuegos👾 con mas contenido de gameplay 4K en español🇪🇸). Suscríbete, comenta, juega y gana, para jugar con la comunidad no dudes en comentárnoslo aquí en el foro =D
Al final, mamá naturaleza les pondrá a tod@s una demanda por inspirarse en sus diseños originales...😝🤣
A ver si nos enteramos en qué consiste el ingringimiento de copyright y podemos desvelar el misterio!!
Vi por ahi (sin haberse demostrado, claro está) que habían usado directamente los modelos 3D de pokemon y hecho cambios mínimos, si eso no es plagio que me expliquen qué lo es.
Y no se puede ignorar el hecho de que a pesar de ser un buen juego, Palworld la petó en parte por la controversia y porque desde antes que saliera los medios lo llamaron el "pokemon con armas". Si no hubiese tenido un parecido visual tan razonable con Pokemon, probablemente hubiera pasado desapercibido como tantos otros juegos de este tipo.
Con lo de los emuladores estamos de acuerdo, pero es cierto que si es tan agresiva es porque en ocasiones han estado emulando juegos que aún estaban a la venta 🤷♀️
PD, no creo que la intención de los desarrolladores fuese hacer un juego meme o una parodia (como en Helldivers, que claramente es humor).
Al final, mamá naturaleza les pondrá a tod@s una demanda por inspirarse en sus diseños originales...😝🤣
A ver si nos enteramos en qué consiste el ingringimiento de copyright y podemos desvelar el misterio!!
Vi por ahi (sin haberse demostrado, claro está) que habían usado directamente los modelos 3D de pokemon y hecho cambios mínimos, si eso no es plagio que me expliquen qué lo es.
Y no se puede ignorar el hecho de que a pesar de ser un buen juego, Palworld la petó en parte por la controversia y porque desde antes que saliera los medios lo llamaron el "pokemon con armas". Si no hubiese tenido un parecido visual tan razonable con Pokemon, probablemente hubiera pasado desapercibido como tantos otros juegos de este tipo.
Con lo de los emuladores estamos de acuerdo, pero es cierto que si es tan agresiva es porque en ocasiones han estado emulando juegos que aún estaban a la venta 🤷♀️
PD, no creo que la intención de los desarrolladores fuese hacer un juego meme o una parodia (como en Helldivers, que claramente es humor).
El tema es que no es demanda por copyright, sino por patentes, y ahí, bueno... en el mundo de los videojuegos habitualmente son demandas que suponen un lastre para la industria. Hay por ejemplo una patente para tirar bolas a bichos y capturarlos... sin comentarios XD.
Puede ser cosas por una forma de hacer algo que otros mil hagan igual o algo genérico pero que se parece mucho como el tener un juego que empiezas sin bichos y vas capturando bichos para luego superar edificios donde hay un boss como método de progresión. Incluso podria ser por interfaces que se parecen o algo de sustituir ataques por otros, rotaciones de debilidades de elementos, etc :P. A saber, estos temas legales pueden ser muy rebuscados y pueden encontrar cosas que sean exactamente iguales a sus juegos aun sin intencion de querer copiarlo solo por verlo adecuado y comodo que si se supiera que estaba patentado podrian haber cambiado pero... me temo que no hay forma de buscar en patentes todas las posibilidades de cosas que pueda haber en un juego :S, no va a ser facil tener un buscador de formas, interacciones, etc a menos que te prepares tu propia patente y luego uses IA para investigar bases de datos tan gigantescas, algo, inviable y lastroso para la industria me temo.
Solo Nintendo sabe que cosas se sacara de la manga XD. Cosas que posiblemente podría haber informado y que se sabían seguramente desde antes de salir del juego y no hacerlo casi 1 año después del lanzamiento cuando ven que tiene mas fama, y con razón que la mayoría de juegos de Pokémon actuales.
Me encantan los productos de Nintendo pero hasta 4 jugadores, 8 a lo sumo, para juegos que puedas estar un par de horas dándole y ya como los de peleas, coches y minijuegos... pero realmente para juegos de mundo abierto no he visto nada que me llame de ellos y si encima todo debe ser pasado por un filtro family friend pues... XD.
Es lo gracioso de Palworld, gráficos y tal muy para niños pero luego el trasfondo y jugabilidad puede verse bastante turbio :P, no olvidare cuando vi al compañero esclavizando al pobre mercader XD... yo si eso solo lo hacia con los bandidos y esclavistas para darles de su propia medicina :P.
Aunque me da igual, de aqui a 3 años seguramente estaremos otra vez saturados de juegos de supervivencia y capturar bichitos... esperemos que Ark 2 se ponga las pilas... en el primero ya teniamos "pokeball" para capturar dinosaurios y mandarlos a lucha incluso en manadas XD.
El conocimiento es poder, úsalo bien, pues su mal uso conlleva a la destrucción.
📹Grabando videos de juegos 4K de vez en cuando (seguramente el canal de videojuegos👾 con mas contenido de gameplay 4K en español🇪🇸). Suscríbete, comenta, juega y gana, para jugar con la comunidad no dudes en comentárnoslo aquí en el foro =D
Registration to this forum is free! We do insist that you abide by the rules and policies detailed
below. If you agree to the terms, please check the 'I agree' checkbox and press the 'Complete Registration' button below.
If you would like to cancel the registration, click here
to return to the forums index.
Legion Community Terms and Conditions
Last updated 09 March 2023
Welcome to Legion Community (“Legion Community” or the “Platform") - powered by Standing on Giants*- an online communication platform operated by Lenovo (the “Client”) at Lenovo Technology UK Ltd, 2nd Floor, Redwood, Crockford Lane, Chineham Park, Basingstoke RG24 8WQ. United Kingdom.
Legion Community enables its registered users (the “Users") to post and share content, such as information about Lenovo products, services, events, social media activity and videos ("Content”) to the Platform.
Legion Community is provided by Lenovo through the services of Standing on Giants subject to these Terms (“Terms”). We reserve the right to amend these Terms at any time and without notice. If we amend the Terms, we will post the amended Terms on this page gaming.lenovo.com/emea/register/ and indicate at the top of the page the date the Terms were last revised. Your continued use of the Platform after any such changes constitutes your acceptance of the new Terms.
By accessing or using Legion Community you signify that you have read, understood, and agree to be bound by these Terms. If you do not agree, then you should not access or use the Platform.
Lenovo’s decision in relation to any aspect of Legion Community and these Terms is final and binding.
Your Use of Legion Community Platform
ELIGIBILITY. This Program is open to Participants who are age 18 years or older at the time of entry. Participants who are under 18 may only participate with the express permission of a parent or legal guardian. This Program is not open to: (1) employees or internally contracted vendors of [Client] or its parent/subsidiaries, agents or affiliates; (2) the immediate family members or members of the same household of any such employee or vendor; (3) anyone professionally involved in the development or administration of this Program; (4) employees or internally contracted vendors of governments and government-affiliated companies or organizations; or (5) any employee whose employer's guidelines or regulations do not allow entry in the Program. This Program is open to residents of Italy, Spain, Norway, Finland, Sweden, Denmark, Kingdom of Saudi Arabia, United Arab Emirates, South Africa, France, Poland, Russia, Egypt. This Program is void in any other country and where otherwise prohibited or restricted by law.
HOW TO PARTICIPATE. To participate in the Program, visit gaming.lenovo.com/emea/es accurately and truthfully complete the online registration form, agree to the terms and conditions of this Agreement, and follow the other instructions at the website listed above.
REWARDS. Subject to the terms and conditions of this Agreement, and once confirmed by [Client], Participants will be able to accrue “points” that can be redeemed for reward(s). Rewards will be featured at various price points and in limited quantities.
The approximate retail values of rewards are subject to change based on current market conditions at the time of reward redemption. Participants are not entitled to any surplus between actual retail value (ARV) of a reward and stated ARV and any difference between stated ARV and actual value of the reward will not be awarded. No substitution, assignment, transfer, or cash redemption of any reward is allowed. Lenovo reserves the right to substitute a reward with another reward of equal or greater value should the advertised reward become unavailable for any reason. If applicable, rewards may be fulfilled in the form of voucher(s), coupon(s) and/or gift card(s) in Lenovo’s sole discretion. If a Participant is unable to participate in or accept a reward or any portion of a reward for any reason, Lenovo shall have no further obligation to such Participant. Lenovo will not replace any lost or stolen rewards after redemption by Participants. In no event will Lenovo be responsible for fulfilling more than the stated number of rewards. Participants acknowledge and agree that rewards are available in limited quantities and reward type and availability are subject to change at Lenovo’s sole discretion. Lenovo shall have no obligation or liability to Participants for any changes made to reward type or availability.
Subject to your compliance with these Terms, Lenovo grants you a non-exclusive, non-transferable, limited right to access and use the Platform only for your personal, informational, and non-commercial use. You agree not to interrupt or attempt to interrupt the operation of the Platform in any way or circumvent or attempt to circumvent any security feature of the Platform. Your use of the information and Content available on the Platform is subject to the following restrictions:
You must not modify or remove any and all copyright, trademark or other proprietary notices contained in the Content.
You must not modify the Content in any way or reproduce or publicly display, perform, or distribute or otherwise use the Content for any commercial purpose.
No title or ownership rights in the Content or any intellectual property rights therein are transferred to you under these Terms. You may never use another user's account without the permission of that user. When creating your account, you must provide accurate and complete information and you must keep your account password secure. You must notify Lenovo immediately of any breach of security or unauthorised use of your account. Lenovo will not be liable for any and all losses caused by any unauthorised use of your account
You agree not to collect or harvest any personal data from the Platform including any personally identifiable information such as but not limited to account names, nor to use the communication systems provided by the Platform for any commercial solicitation purposes. You agree not to use any portion of the Platform as a destination linked from any unsolicited bulk messages or unsolicited commercial messages.
Your Content Posted or Linked to Legion Community
Lenovo allows you to submit posts or link content to Legion Community, including photos, images, videos, sounds, comments, links, tweets, likes, and other materials. A Legion Community moderator may moderate posts after publication. Lenovo reserves the right to remove user’s content that it considers to be irrelevant to the purpose of the platform, or that it considers violates any of these Terms. Lenovo may also post or link to the Platform any of your Content that you make available to Lenovo for the Platform. You are solely responsible for your Content that is posted or linked to the Platform and Lenovo accepts no liability for your Content.
You grant Lenovo and other users of the Platform a non-exclusive, royalty-free, transferable, sub-licensable, worldwide license to use, store, display, reproduce, modify, create derivative works of, perform, publish, re-post, re-tweet, and distribute your Content on or in connection with the Platform.
You represent and warrant that you have all rights necessary in your Content for it to be on or available from the Platform, and that the posting and use of your Content on or through the Platform does not violate, misappropriate or infringe on the rights of any third party, including, without limitation, privacy rights, publicity rights, copyrights, trademark and/or other intellectual property rights. You further represent and warrant to the extent there are links on the Platform to your Content that is hosted on third party websites, such linking is permitted by the terms of service of any such third party websites. You agree to comply with all laws, rules and regulations applicable to your use of the Platform and your Content, including but not limited to copyright laws.
You agree that your Content will not include any violent, discriminatory, unlawful, infringing, hateful, defamatory, derogatory, harassing, pornographic or obscene photos, text, images, messages, references, content or other materials. In addition, your Content will not be confidential or proprietary, and Lenovo will have no confidentiality obligation regarding your Content.
You agree that Lenovo is only acting as a passive conduit for your online distribution and publication of your Content. Lenovo does not have any obligation to review your Content, and therefore does not guarantee the accuracy, integrity, or quality of all user Content and we cannot assure you that harmful, inaccurate, deceptive, offensive, threatening, defamatory, unlawful, or otherwise objectionable Content will not appear on the Platform. Lenovo is not responsible for any public display or misuse of your Content. Lenovo does however reserve the right to remove, exclude or modify your Content for any reason, at its discretion, including any Content that Lenovo believes violates these Terms or other applicable policies. UNDER NO CIRCUMSTANCES WILL LENOVO BE LIABLE TO YOU OR ANY THIRD PARTY IN ANY WAY FOR ANY CONTENT POSTED ON OR MADE AVAILABLE THROUGH A SITE BY YOU OR ANY OTHER USER.
Lenovo may reward points for certain activities on the Platform, including (but not limited to) sharing posts, creating posts and entering competitions. Subject to availability, Lenovo reserves the right at any time to amend, modify or retract any points, rewards or prizes earned on the Platform. You accept that Lenovo will not enter into any correspondence regarding the awarding of points or rewards and Lenovo is entitled to grant or revoke rewards at their discretion. The decision of Lenovo in relation to all aspects of this programme is final and binding.
Data Privacy and Security
Lenovo will communicate with you via email or push notifications (including via the Standing on Giants platform), about Legion Community related notices changes to features of Legion Community and any notices required by law, in lieu of communication by postal mail.. If required by law, we will ask you for consent before sending you marketing emails. Please note that you may unsubscribe to general marketing emails at any time using the link provided in the emails. You understand that your data may be shared with other Lenovo entities and trusted third parties with a contractual relationship with Lenovo solely in connection with Legion Community
Please read our Data Privacy Policyfor more information on our privacy and security practices.
Representations and Warranties
You represent and warrant that:
(a) You will abide by and comply with these Terms;
(b) Your Content and Lenovo’s use thereof as contemplated by these Terms and the Platform will not infringe any rights of any third party, including but not limited to any intellectual property rights, privacy rights, and rights of publicity;
(c) You have the full power and authority to enter into these Terms and to the extent that any entity is bound hereby, to bind such entity, these Terms, and performance of obligations under these Terms do not and will not violate any other agreement to which you or such entity is a party; and
(d) You will comply with all applicable laws and regulations, including but not limited to those set forth in these Terms.
Compliance
When using Legion Community, you will comply with all applicable laws and regulations, and all terms of use and similar rules concerning your use of any Social Media Outlet or other third party publishing platform.
Upon our request made to you from time to time, you will cooperate with us and allow us access to your systems, communications, and records solely in connection with determining your compliance with these Terms.
Visiting Third Party Websites
The Platform may contain links to third party websites, advertisers, products, services, offers, or other events or activities that are not owned or controlled by Lenovo. Lenovo does not assume any responsibility for any such third party sites, information, materials, products, services or offers. If you access any third party website, product, service, or content from the Platform, you do so at your own risk and you agree that Lenovo will have no liability arising from your use of or access to any third party website, product, service, or content.
Trademarks and Ownership of Intellectual Property
Lenovo™, the Lenovo logo, and certain other product names and phrases are trademarks or service marks of Lenovo in the U.S. and/or other countries. The absence of a trademark or service mark designation next to a product or service name or logo belonging to Lenovo anywhere on the Platform does not constitute a waiver of Lenovo’s trademark or other intellectual property rights concerning that name or logo used or referenced on the Platform.
The Platform contains content owned or licensed by Lenovo ("Lenovo Content"). Lenovo Content is protected by copyright, trademark, trade secret and other laws, and, as between you and Lenovo, Lenovo owns and retains all copyright, trademark, trade secret, patent and other intellectual property rights in and to Lenovo Content and the Platform (the “Intellectual Property”). Lenovo reserves all rights in the Lenovo Content and Intellectual Property not expressly granted in these Terms. Lenovo does not permit the use of the Lenovo Content or its Intellectual Property in advertising, as an endorsement for any product or service, or for any other purpose, commercial or otherwise, without the prior express written permission of Lenovo.
Termination
You may terminate use of the Platform at any time for any reason (in other words, un-register). Lenovo may terminate or suspend your right to use the Platform at any time, with or without cause or notice to you. Lenovo may terminate the Platform at any time without notice. Upon termination, all licenses and other rights granted to you in these Terms will immediately cease. Following termination, Lenovo may retain your Content as permitted by applicable law for backup, archival, or audit purposes. Furthermore, Lenovo and its other users may retain and continue to use, store, display, reproduce, modify, create derivative works of, perform, and distribute any of your Content that other users have stored or shared through the Platform.
Indemnification
You agree to defend, indemnify and hold harmless Lenovo and its employees, officers, affiliates and agents from and against any claims, liabilities, damages, losses, and expenses, including without limitation, reasonable attorney's fees and costs, arising out of or in any way connected with any of the following: (i) Your Content or your misuse of the Platform; (ii) your breach or alleged breach of these Terms; (iii) your violation of any third party right, including without limitation, any intellectual property right, publicity, confidentiality, property or privacy right; (iv) your violation of any laws, rules, regulations, codes, statutes, ordinances or orders of any governmental authorities, including, without limitation, all regulatory, administrative and legislative authorities; or (v) any misrepresentation made by you. You will cooperate as reasonably requested by Lenovo with respect to any such claim. Lenovo reserves the right to assume control of the defence or settlement of any such claim, and you will not in any event settle any such claim without the prior written consent of Lenovo.
Governing Law
These Terms are governed by the laws of Spain.
Entire Agreement; Severability
These Terms, together with Lenovo’s Data Privacy Policy and any amendments and any additional agreements you may enter into with Lenovo in connection with the Platform, shall constitute the entire agreement between you and Lenovo concerning the Platform. If any provision of these Terms is deemed invalid, then that provision will be limited or eliminated to the minimum extent necessary, and the remaining provisions of these Terms will remain in full force and effect.
Limitations of Liability
Neither Lenovo nor its affiliates, officers, directors, employees, agents, third party content providers, sponsors, or licensors warrant that the Site will be continuous, uninterrupted or error-free. THE PLATFORM, INCLUDING WITHOUT LIMITATION, ITS CONTENT, IS PROVIDED ON AN "AS IS" AND "AS AVAILABLE" BASIS. TO THE FULLEST EXTENT PERMISSIBLE BY LAW, LENOVO HEREBY DISCLAIMS ALL WARRANTIES, EXPRESS OR IMPLIED, INCLUDING, BUT NOT LIMITED TO, THE WARRANTIES OF MERCHANTABILITY, FITNESS FOR A PARTICULAR PURPOSE OR NON-INFRINGEMENT, OR ANY WARRANTIES BASED ON A COURSE OF DEALING. TO THE MAXIMUM EXTENT PERMITTED BY LAW, LENOVO SHALL NOT BE LIABLE FOR ANY DAMAGES, OR ANY LOSS OF PROFITS OR REVENUES, OR ANY LOSS OF DATA OR USE, RESULTING FROM YOUR ACCESS TO OR USE OF OR INABILITY TO ACCESS OR USE LEGION COMMUNITY, EVEN IF LENOVO HAS BEEN ADVISED OF THE POSSIBILITY OF ANY SUCH DAMAGES IN ADVANCE.
*The Standing on Giants platform organizes brand content and allows platform members to discuss this content through written comments